Tesla introduces more realistic range estimates for Model Y, S, and X vehicles

Don't forget to subtract about 25% off the range if you live in places with cold weather (Chicago, NYC, Boston) that hits below freezing regularly in the winter.

I'm not a fan of Musk, and this just reinforces my disdain of him. I see him as a charlatan who could care less whether he speaks truth or not - as long as he gets attention and more money.

R00sT3R said:

I don't know how electric cars are viable in the US where distances are so vast.

Here in the UK a range of 250-300 miles could easily be enough for commuting to work and leisure activities for the entire week but in the US where a 'local' journey to work and/or the shops can be a 2hr, 100 mile round trip...doesn't seem practical.

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Such distances can be the case in the US, but it isn't everyone. I am about to purchase a 2024 Prius Prime XSE with a rated all-electric range of 39-mi. For my daily commute, round trip, that will last me about three days. However, Toyota is known for under rating their ranges. For instance, my neighbor has a Prius Prime from the previous generation which is rated at 24-mi all electric range. She says she gets 38-mi all-electric range. I don't know what I will get with the 2024, but it would not surprise me if I get more than the rated all-electric range.

Another interesting story about Tesla and its BS https://techxplore.com/news/2024-01-tesla-recall-mn-cars-china.html

I wonder if Musk would be pulling this crap if he were a citizen of China.

nnguy2 said:

Don't forget to subtract about 25% off the range if you live in places with cold weather (Chicago, NYC, Boston) that hits below freezing regularly in the winter.

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It can be worse, up to 50% loss due to extreme cold temps. It's even gotten so cold in MN before that I knew a couple of people that had Tesla cars and they wouldn't even charge. The cars sat for several weeks until it finally warmed up past the negatives for a high before the cars would take a charge.

"Tesla introduces more realistic range estimates for Model Y, S, and X vehicles"

The new estimates are still a Lie...!

"Tesla introduces more realistic range estimates for Model Y, S, and X vehicles"

The EV range of most companies are Lies...!

... And remains lies until a Detailed Range Estimate is developed to indicate wind, temperature and load capacity factors and presented to buyer before purchase...!

wiyosaya said:

I'm not a fan of Musk, and this just reinforces my disdain of him. I see him as a charlatan who could care less whether he speaks truth or not - as long as he gets attention and more money.

Such distances can be the case in the US, but it isn't everyone. I am about to purchase a 2024 Prius Prime XSE with a rated all-electric range of 39-mi. For my daily commute, round trip, that will last me about three days. However, Toyota is known for under rating their ranges. For instance, my neighbor has a Prius Prime from the previous generation which is rated at 24-mi all electric range. She says she gets 38-mi all-electric range. I don't know what I will get with the 2024, but it would not surprise me if I get more than the rated all-electric range.

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wiyosaya said:

Another interesting story about Tesla and its BS https://techxplore.com/news/2024-01-tesla-recall-mn-cars-china.html

I wonder if Musk would be pulling this crap if he were a citizen of China.

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The "recall" in question is the same OTA software update already applied to vehicles in other markets, as the cited story states this is to further inhibit customers from abusing the autonomous functions of the vehicle. If you pick up a rock and pitch it through a window that's on you not the big bang. As for the mileage adjustments and such I'd suggest you look into Toyota's amphitheatre of skeletons as well, they aren't so clean as their US image would have you believe. Though the way they dodged US import bans to California in the 70's by shipping "unfinished" pickup trucks to California and bolting the truck beds onto the bodies in CA was one of the most spectacularly naked GFY's toward predatory legislation in history. I for one will always respect that type of creative problem solving in the face of litigious headwinds, much as I'm seeing from Tesla today.


All manufacturers should be held to the same account, once the rest catch up to Tesla on the 95% of the technical aspects of their lead we can have a genuine conversation about refining that last 5% that includes range estimation semantics and fit and finish.

The EV push is a political campaign fueled by the pathetic liberals.

1. They're not feasible for most commuters due to its short range
2. They're expensive.
2. Very few people have 30-45 mins to sit at charging station (when you can even find one). and if you're waiting in line for a free charging station, it could be hour+.
3. Most power grids in the US don't have the infrastructure to handle EVs. CA has already proven this when one of their grids had a blowout because it couldn't handle the demand.

I'm not against EVs. If you're a homebody and normally don't commute very far, yes, its a great substitute for gas powered vehicles. However, this whole gimmick of trying to push everyone into the EV direction is beyond stupid, as the tecnology isn't even close to being accepted as mainstream for majority of drivers.

yRaz said:

Maybe it's because all my American friends with Teslas drive like **** waffles to show off their ridiculous acceleration. I used to think that BMW drivers were the worst but I guess they all just bought Teslas

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What only a very few people understand, is that electric motors produce their maximum output when they're stalled.

So, if you prevent the armature from rotating, the "horsepower", (and collateral current draw), will keep increasing, until the motor destroys itself and goes up in flames. Which is what the tires and the static weight of the vehicle do, (temporarily at least), prevent the armature from turning.

So, the blinding acceleration of a Tesla from a standing start, is a characteristic of electric motors in general (**), and has absolutely nothing to do with Musk's, (alleged) genius.

(**) Of course Musk's proclivity for self aggrandizing, along with stuffing way larger motors in Teslas than are anywhere near necessary, play an important role as well.

I've had a Ford Escape PHEV for over a year now. Perfect balance, EV mode handles most trips and the ones it doesn't is handled by the ICE. Takes about 3-4 months to get through a tank of gas. If the battery was just a smidge bigger that would probably be 4-5 months per fill ups.

FaTaL said:

The EV push is a political campaign fueled by the pathetic liberals.

1. They're not feasible for most commuters due to its short range
2. They're expensive.
2. Very few people have 30-45 mins to sit at charging station (when you can even find one). and if you're waiting in line for a free charging station, it could be hour+.
3. Most power grids in the US don't have the infrastructure to handle EVs. CA has already proven this when one of their grids had a blowout because it couldn't handle the demand.

I'm not against EVs. If you're a homebody and normally don't commute very far, yes, its a great substitute for gas powered vehicles. However, this whole gimmick of trying to push everyone into the EV direction is beyond stupid, as the tecnology isn't even close to being accepted as mainstream for majority of drivers.

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The 'range anxiety' problem is being fixed. waaay too slowly' thru Government funding etc, Walmarts, grocery stores, restaurants etc etc etc are all putting in chargers so you don't need to spend "30-45 minutes" waiting to get your car upto 100%, you can stop at 80% which often takes less than half that time, because the next charge is now within your range. Years ago the Government said no commercial stuff in rest stops on the Interstate hiway system which is preventing them from being in the rest stops too. As you problably know NJ has it's own exception so who knows what might happen there. But even regular gas stations are putting in chargers to lure people to go inside and spend money while their car charges.

Several companies are working on the 2nd problem of chargers that don't work and lots of people are investing in them as they see that as a long term problem going forward, though with all the car makers making deals with Tesla to use their chargers some of the companies won't be around for long.

R00sT3R said:

I don't know how electric cars are viable in the US where distances are so vast.

Here in the UK a range of 250-300 miles could easily be enough for commuting to work and leisure activities for the entire week but in the US where a 'local' journey to work and/or the shops can be a 2hr, 100 mile round trip...doesn't seem practical.

Click to expand...

There is a supercharger network. Tesla automatically reroutes you if you won't make it to your destination after inputing in the address. I don't think there is a single person that has a daily commute to work greater than 300 miles. A bad commute is like 50 miles.

nnguy2 said:

Don't forget to subtract about 25% off the range if you live in places with cold weather (Chicago, NYC, Boston) that hits below freezing regularly in the winter.

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I didn't research other cars, but newer Tesla's have a heat pump that warms up batteries if they are colder than optimal. No range loss on my MYP. I live in Chicago.

You can learn more here.
https://insideevs.com/news/632388/tesla-innovative-efficient-heat-pump-explained-new-video/

wiyosaya said:

Another interesting story about Tesla and its BS https://techxplore.com/news/2024-01-tesla-recall-mn-cars-china.html

I wonder if Musk would be pulling this crap if he were a citizen of China.

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Yeah mine got recalled when I was sleeping. Woke up and it's all fixed now. If this was a gas car, I'd have to give a dealership a car for a week. That's if the parts were in stock.

Neatfeatguy said:

It can be worse, up to 50% loss due to extreme cold temps. It's even gotten so cold in MN before that I knew a couple of people that had Tesla cars and they wouldn't even charge. The cars sat for several weeks until it finally warmed up past the negatives for a high before the cars would take a charge.

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I'm not sure if you're trolling or extremely gullible.

netman said:

"Tesla introduces more realistic range estimates for Model Y, S, and X vehicles"

The EV range of most companies are Lies...!

... And remains lies until a Detailed Range Estimate is developed to indicate wind, temperature and load capacity factors and presented to buyer before purchase...!

Click to expand...

Are you implying that range estimator of gas cars is similiarily a lie since they don't take into account any of those factors? I think you just make a good case as to why EPA numbers will always be an estimate.

FaTaL said:

The EV push is a political campaign fueled by the pathetic liberals.

1. They're not feasible for most commuters due to its short range
2. They're expensive.
2. Very few people have 30-45 mins to sit at charging station (when you can even find one). and if you're waiting in line for a free charging station, it could be hour+.
3. Most power grids in the US don't have the infrastructure to handle EVs. CA has already proven this when one of their grids had a blowout because it couldn't handle the demand.

I'm not against EVs. If you're a homebody and normally don't commute very far, yes, its a great substitute for gas powered vehicles. However, this whole gimmick of trying to push everyone into the EV direction is beyond stupid, as the tecnology isn't even close to being accepted as mainstream for majority of drivers.

Click to expand...

You best own those libs and keep driving that Ford pickup. That will show them.

1. I don't know of anyone who works more than 150 miles away from work and drives. That would be a killer for a gas car with all the maintenance you have to do.
2. False. Average selling price might be high but that's because there are no econoboxes available yet. Most are luxury cars. Plenty of Teslas, Audis, BMWs, and MBs EVs. Even though, got a $11,500 rebate on my MYP. MY starts at $44k. Find me a comparable car for $32.5k after rebate. Prius Prime is $33k. LOL
3. False. Any facts to back this up? EVs caused a blowout? LOL Maybe in Texas but that's a republican grid that can't handle someone turning on AC in their home. Their wind turbines froze because republicans got some cheap ones with no ice protection. Meanwhile, the ones up north run just fine in snow, ice and much colder weather.

Technology of EVs is so far ahead of gas cars. If it's too much for you, stick to Ford pickups.

BabaYaga said:

You best own those libs and keep driving that Ford pickup. That will show them.

1. I don't know of anyone who works more than 150 miles away from work and drives. That would be a killer for a gas car with all the maintenance you have to do.
2. False. Average selling price might be high but that's because there are no econoboxes available yet. Most are luxury cars. Plenty of Teslas, Audis, BMWs, and MBs EVs. Even though, got a $11,500 rebate on my MYP. MY starts at $44k. Find me a comparable car for $32.5k after rebate. Prius Prime is $33k. LOL
3. False. Any facts to back this up? EVs caused a blowout? LOL Maybe in Texas but that's a republican grid that can't handle someone turning on AC in their home. Their wind turbines froze because republicans got some cheap ones with no ice protection. Meanwhile, the ones up north run just fine in snow, ice and much colder weather.

Technology of EVs is so far ahead of gas cars. If it's too much for you, stick to Ford pickups.

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1. you clearly havent seen what happens when *cheap* EVS are left out in sub -10F weather for a night when not plugged in. There are several videos on youtube showing how such vehicles fail to start, have no remaining charge, ece. Even teslas have had issues. And this is before we get into the sheer range loss from such cold weather, which you may not want to admit to but tens of million live in every winter. Gas vehicles solved the cold weather starting issue with fuel injection in the 80s. Taking that 250 mile range, taking off 30% for "acceptable" wear and tear, and another 30% for codl weather loss, suddenly you are struggling to make 100 miles on a full charge.
2. Utter BS. You know its BS, I know its BS. Yes, EVs *exist* at prices comparable to gas vehicles, but a $40k chevy sonic with a 200 mile range and playskool plastic interior is not comparable to a $40k turbocharged crossover with leather seats and bells and whistles. $11,500 rebate means you got the full $7500 tax rebate and a further $4000, likely fromt he state, which means you are making 6 figures and can take advantage of said rebates. Most are not that wealthy, nor live in your state that offers that extra $4k.
3. What part of "california cant maintain the grid it has now" missed your head? Cali already has major issues with brownouts during summer AC use. They are far from the only one, but they are the most consistent with their problems. This got bad enough that Cali proposed and passed legislation banning certain PC configurations that draw too much power (it was here on techspot if you want to go find it). EVs draw FAR more power then anything else we have, charging an EV for a weeks worth of driving realistically doubles electric usage of many households in low demand months. Colorado had an electric utility use smart AC controls to turn up people's AC during a heatwave due to electrical shortages (again, was hereon techspot).

If you're not willing to engage with reality, stick to your Chevy Bolt and tell everyone how SmArT you are for driving a legal go kart.

BabaYaga said:

I'm not sure if you're trolling or extremely gullible.

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So, you mean that guy at my work that couldn't get his Tesla to start after showing up to work when we had a really bad cold snap (never got over -10C for nearly 2 weeks straight) and his car wouldn't take a charge until after the cold snap?

Or when he told me that the range on his car when it gets that cold is nearly half of what it normally is?

He's not the only person I knew that has the same issues with their electric car when it got that extremely cold for that long.

Sounds like you're upset about an issue that's out of your control.

BabaYaga said:

Yeah mine got recalled when I was sleeping. Woke up and it's all fixed now. If this was a gas car, I'd have to give a dealership a car for a week. That's if the parts were in stock.

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So if the computer in a gas car needed to be re-flashed it could take a week, that is, if the parts were in stock?

That doesn't make any sense.

BabaYaga said:

There is a supercharger network. Tesla automatically reroutes you if you won't make it to your destination after inputing in the address. I don't think there is a single person that has a daily commute to work greater than 300 miles. A bad commute is like 50 miles.

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I think you meant to say that a commute like 50 miles is long, not bad. Assuming it is bad is simply in the eye of the beholder. Some people like to drive. I don't. I would think that 50 miles is an awful commute. I'm ecstatic mine is only 10 miles each way. I know someone that drives just shy of 50 miles (one way) to his job everyday and he likes the drive. I think he's nuts, but he likes it.

I had a friend offer me a job at a location that would be a 30 mile drive one way, but pay me $15k more a year than I'm making now. $15k more a year would actually only end up being around $6-7k more after taxes, gas and the extra wear & tear on my car a year. So not worth it to me, especially more so since I hate driving (actually it's not the drive itself, it's having to deal with all the other re†ards on the road), for a few extra grand a year. My mental health is more important than stressing out being on the road.